16 Comments Family & de facto law, financial agreements, consent orders
spousal maintenance seems to be your main concern. I don't think you have much to worry about there.
As far as your first point about $$$ can't help. No idea
Do you want more time with the kids?
As far as school fees, your third point...
the CSA rules regarding that are found at
I like this bit - well the first bit any ways. I'm quoting from the CSA site:
"Where the payer is meeting the costs, it may be appropriate to reduce the assessment to reflect that the payer is directly meeting more than their appropriate share of the costs. However, another alternative is to increase the assessment and for the payer to claim credit (as non-agency payments) for any payments that they make directly to third parties in relation to training and education costs for the child. "
So I interpret that as stop paying for everything and pay your child support. She can then apply for CSA to come after you...
U'm so you offered 70/30 and she knocked it back - I'm assuming she gets the 70?... Man she is out for blood... I think the Calderbank stuff is to get you to agree that you can't come at her for costs? BUT not too sure on that one... Makes sense but - given you've offered 70 she is at risk of having costs ordered against her down the track because she could have saved everyone all this trouble and accepted the 70% because that don't sound all that bad from where I'm sitting BUT I don't have all the details...
So as to points 2,4 and 5 of your post, they are all asking the same thing... Spousal maintenance.... And like I said, I don't think so. The inequity of income will be balanced out with her getting a bigger chunk of the property settlement.
So last thing - Just checking - you are offereing her 70%? right
emca01 2016-03-01 20:29:45
and yes i do want to see kids more but as i didnt get to see kids for initial 4 -5 months and had DVO against me so i did agree with consent orders to have short time only so that i can start the meaningful relationship.
I want to see more of them but she refuses and says that she will never give me kids for night stay or or more as that will impact her child support payments.
mate I reckon you wanna work out a better plan. The consent orders are a bit of a mess but they are fixable. How much time would you like to have with the kids?
I'd be saying hey - 70% and a change in parenting to give you more time with kids. OR she can take you to court, she won't get 70% and hopefully a good solicitor will help her see that.
Mate how long ago were the consent orders done? Maybe you could look a t some sorta compromise - More time with kids and you'll pay some of school fees. But to get the ball rolling stop paying for anything but child support and see if you can buy some time with the kids by agreeing to pay for some of the school fees.
emca01 2016-03-02 10:20:18
Her lawyer is saying that as she is on $50k & i am on $140k , and i have kids only for 10 hrs in a week, she will recieve 80% from the court and also spouse maintenance and kids maintenance in addition to child support as assessed by CSA.
Is this correct ? i mean i will have savings after my expenses but i am renting currently but want to buy a house in future and need to save to arrange for deposit for house. Does court will only look into my current situation or my future need.
I cant make any sense of their saying that i have to pay kids maintenance and still dont get kids access and also i need to keep on renting and pay extra money to them as spouse maintenance...
Forget what her solicitor says. You have never spoken to her solicitor have you? so you're dealing with chinese whispers.
I once got a letter from the ex's solicitor, it represented a asset division where the ex got 105% of the assets. YEP 105%. My solicitor told me it was stupid. So when I asked why my ex's solicitor agreed to make such a proposal the answer my solicitor gave was that the most likely reason for such a stupid proposal was that my ex was not listening to the good advice that the solicitor was providing my ex.
yes future needs is one factor.
I'm guessing you have a solicitor.... I'd have a chat with solicitor about proposing 75% (if you're prepared to go that high) BUT only if new consent orders are made that provide you with greater access to the kids. Now unless the kids are under 3yrs of age then I reckon you should expect 4-5 nights a fortnight and half holidays.) Short version, start working out what you want and then discuss that with your solicitor to see how achievable it is. BUT at present you're in a bit of a bind. The consent orders for kids are a hassle if you want more time with kids you're gonna need to work out an angle to get it... And once the asset division is done, you've lost one of those angles to try and negotiate more time with kids.
So is more time with kids something you want?
emca01 2016-03-02 15:09:49
Thanks for your valuable advise, i definitely want more access with kids and even ready to have 100% access but i do know its not practical for kids development also as they do require both parents for their well being and growth.
I guess one big (mistake) if it is i did is that as i didnt had any access to kids initially and when offered in consent orders the access of 10 hrs, agreed to whatever conditions they put in.
1. Supervised access with my brother even though she has provided unsupervised access since those consent orders for last 5 months
and conditions like i need to attend behaviour change program, alcohal abuse program, psychiatric assessment.
My psychologist advised me that i dont need to do all these things as i am perfect and same assessment was done by hospital. I am not sure how to get away with these conditions if i agreed in consent orders in order to ask for more access.
When i had another look into their counter offer today, they advising a pool of $320 (including about $160k assets saying i own overseas which is incorrect) and out of that they are offering me $200k (including those non existent assets) which amounts to around 65% in my favour and then asking me to pay them spousal maintenance & kids maintenance in addition to child support assessed.
Above division proposal made me stressed but did laugh after i understood ... this is completely backing your point of why you got 105% proposal....how on earth someone can so stupid as in first giving 65% and then saying she is in need of spousal maintenance and additional expenses for kids :)
Spousal maintenance, not a chance in hell. So long as you don't ever agree to pay it, she'll need an order from the court to get it, and she'll need to show that she's been placed into a position of financial hardship as a result of the marriage. If she's working, she won't get it, regardless of what your earnings are.
Child support, don't ever pay over what the CSA has assessed, even if it's for school, books, clothes, whatever. If she wants the costs of raising the kids to be reduced on her end, she should hand them over to you more often.
Property settlement, 70/30 in her favour is far too generous. Start the process for getting better parenting orders in place, then determine property settlement so it's not influenced by this 'no overnights' BS. You'll get a better deal for spending time with the kids through the court than through your ex.
wow you sound like where I was 4 yrs ago.... SUCKED.
So contact relationships Australia. They organise mediation. It is the first step in getting more time with the kids. They will then contact her. She won't agree to anything BUT it is starting to apply some pressure on her.
yep and NEVER agree to pay more than CSA - or if you do don't pay more than your comfortable with. Paying a little bit extra to keep the peace aint a bad idea. BUT at the minute you could pay for EVERYTHING AND by the sounds of things it would not win you any favours
2 kids? and how old? Could you manage 50/50?
emca01 2016-03-02 18:17:00
kids are 3 yr old & 10 yr old. I do want 50/50 and can manage it but she is denying saying that i have all those allegation(false) against me for family violence bla bla. her solicitor letter says that she is entitled to spouse maintance but she is happy to withdrw if i agree on kids maintenance agreement in addition to child support.
Kids really have a strong connection with me. My 3 yr old always says when he comes to see me that he doesn't want to go back and i just cry after that looking at his position and emotions...
As i had the conditions in the consent orders that i need to complete ;
1. Need to complete the behaviour change programm
2. do the alcohal abuse program
3. do the phsychiateric assessment
If i complete above and give her certificate and if she is satisfied then she will allow unsupervised access but for 10 hrs a week only.
Will the above conditions of consent orders affect my claim now to ask for 50/50, the consent order was done in Start of Nov last year. I agreed to those consent orders only as wanted to start having access to kids as didnt see them much in 6 months prior to that.
look the consent orders are a problem. The courts try to stop orders getting re-visited so that the courts don't get any more cluttered up with idiots who use the courts to extract vengeance etc...
But there are ways around this. So do the courses. HOPEFULLY she will NOT grant you extra unsupervised time. Then maybe you could get inside a court for her not complying with the orders... The other option is to apply to court based on the fact that the orders are manifestly unfair.
BUT you're better off avoiding court all together and finding a way to get a compromise... Yep I know sounds impossible.... But it isn't.
Now as far as your question about the above conditions... They will only affect your claim IF you don't do them. She is putting obstacles in front of you. The more obstacles she puts up and the more you overcome them the weaker her case is down the road and you have to start thinking long term...
BUT - something worries me here. Did you get legal advice around the consent orders? Just seems weird- sorry - but no good solicitor would tell you to accept 10 hours a week in consent orders not unless there is something going on that you've not mentioned?? Or was it just pure frustration?
Just so you know - I had an avo against me, didn't see kids etc. Yep it is a factor that the courts would consider - but would it stop you getting overnight care? HELL NO - not unless you have convictions etc...
You don't say how long you were married or de facto, or when separated. Superannuation is also in the pool. Both sides need full financial disclosure, including overseas assets. So, it's possible keeping your super in a bigger pool could help on the house refinance if she has more equity.
If she says youdon't own something and it's a pure allegation nothing you can do But, if you did own something once and sold it, you'll need to provide details of the sale as proof.
Your house equity is 128k, hers 98k, so you say there's more equity in the house, it seems you need to address the overseas asset issue, I have the same problem, so you need to address each asset the allege one by one.
My personal view, a court wants stability and kids interests. No chance of SM, but just maybe if she needs a little extra equity that could factor into the split to allow her to keep the house for the kids.
As far as consent is cincerned, doing those conditions is probably good for you whether or not you feel you need them. If you get 10 hours supervised, then later on you can revisit opening the orders. For example. Do those orders make provision for time on birthdays, holidays etc.