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timed and untimed parking

Printed From: AussieLegal
Category: Criminal Law, Traffic Matters
Forum Name: Assault, DUI, Drugs, Fraud, AVOs, Traffic Fines
Forum Discription:
URL: https://www.aussielegal.com.au/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=24875
Printed Date: 26/September/2018 at 22:47


Topic: timed and untimed parking
Posted By: crocodile
Subject: timed and untimed parking
Date Posted: 07/November/2017 at 11:42
My workplace fronts onto a council off street parking area. There is room for about 30 cars. When viewed from the street, 15 car parking bays are on the left and another 15 on the right. The bays on the left are timed parking for 2 hours from 9am to 6pm and those on the right have no time restriction.

I parked in the timed zone at around 9:45am, unloaded my car, made one or two calls to customers, made a cup of tea and then moved my car to the other side of the car park. Directly opposite and a total of about 10 metres away. Around 2pm I moved the car back to the timed area to reload some heavy equipment into the car ( My front door is directly outside ). Went inside to pack up my computer and shut the windows. When I returned to the car I had a ticket under the wiper saying that I had overstayed the time limit. Alleged offence between 10:14 and 14:08.

I emailed the council and explained what actually happened. Their only response was to send me a photo of a chalk mark on my tyre. I emailed them again and reiterated my position and pointed out to them that the car had only travelled a total distance of 10m and back to the same position so of course the chalk wouldn't rub off. Needless to say they were not interested and my only option was to have it heard in court.

The ticket is only $110, far smaller than the cost of taking a day off and paying the costs of any witnesses. May I ask you the following:

1. If I choose the court option, what chances do I have in recovering the cost for the day and the cost of bringing witnesses?

2. Is it normal practice for council to force the court option knowing that most people would just pay up and not bother?

3. Are there any other avenues except wasting an entire day in court?

Thanks for a great web forum by the way.



Replies:
Posted By: Eddy
Date Posted: 07/November/2017 at 14:14
1. You won't be able to claim you or your witnesses time.
2. You can't really say that that is their intent (but you may be right). It's normal practice to take a dispute to court.
3. Unless you had, or access to, photographic evidence to back you up then I think paying the fine is going to be the cheapest and quickest way to close the matter (even though you are innocent).

I don't work for council by the way.

That's a very unusual and unfortunate way you ended up getting the fine. The inspector was just doing his/her job.


Posted By: citizen181
Date Posted: 12/November/2017 at 16:56
I agree with the previous response and would suggest that your only hope is that there are in fact two photos that council took, one at the time of marking and a second at the time of booking, it would virtually impossible for the mark to be in the same position on both photos. Even looking at where the mark has been placed on the tyre might give some indication of how and when it was placed, and I'm assuming the same parking space in the timed zone was used on both occasions.

Beyond that well, hope they fill a pothole with your money.


Posted By: citizen-joe
Date Posted: 13/November/2017 at 04:55
Before you decide on the court option it might pay to check the actual parking rules that apply, for instance in my area I am only allowed to park in a specific timed area once per day.


Posted By: crocodile
Date Posted: 15/November/2017 at 23:50
I moved the car forward 10m then moved the car back 10m some time later. Of course the chalk would be in the same place.

Anyway, I've selected the court option. The kind tenant next door to me has given me footage from their security camera that clearly shows my actions. Can even see the parking officer putting the chalk on. No first photo.



Posted By: Eddy
Date Posted: 16/November/2017 at 10:05
Did you check for the parking rule that citizen-joe mentioned - if this is the case then you won't win the dispute. Also, what do you mean by "no first photo"?


Posted By: rannii
Date Posted: 16/November/2017 at 18:12
Yep check rules.

Our state that you can only park for 2 hour limit (and in small print) once per 24 hour period.

So the second time you parked might have breached the rules.


Posted By: crocodile
Date Posted: 16/November/2017 at 19:48
The sign of the front after checking says "2 hours per day in some sections of the carpark". I wasn't in the 2 hour section for anything even close to two hours. Just my luck there'll be some obscure rule somewhere.


Posted By: citizen181
Date Posted: 17/November/2017 at 15:12
I think, being pedantic, with the video, you still have a valid case, if the rule is that you can park for a maximum of 2 hour over any 24 hour period, you should be able to calculate how long you were parked on each of the two occasions. The parking inspector cannot say that you were there continuously for two hours on any single occasion, unless he can show, beyond a reasonable doubt, that his mark was in "exactly" the same spot during both visits which would suggest you hadn't moved, something the video will disprove. Which is why I suggest the inspector should have taken two photos showing the before and after 2 hour position of the mark. Even moving straight back and straight forward again the marks will be in slightly different positions.


Posted By: chrisgeorge2365
Date Posted: 14/February/2018 at 20:50
Jumb the traffic red light, how much fine should I pay ? please tell me the process, how to pay the fine in Sydney.

for your kind information I am from india, facing these issues from a couple of day.
Thsnks


Posted By: NotGuilty
Date Posted: 17/February/2018 at 00:32
The relevant part of Rule 205 of the Australian Road Rules is as follows:

205 Parking for longer than indicated

(1) A driver must not park continuously on a length of road, or in an area, to which a permissive parking sign applies for longer than the period indicated by information on or with the sign or, if rule 206 applies to the driver, the period allowed under that rule.

(2) For subrule (1), a driver parks continuously on a length of road, or in an area, to which a permissive parking sign applies, from the time when the driver parks on the length of road, or in the area, until the driver, or another driver, moves the vehicle off the length of road, or out of the area, to which the permissive parking sign applies.

Sub-rule (2) defines 'continuously'.

As you did not move your vehicle 'out of the area' of the carpark you are deemed to have parked in the carpark continuously regardless of where you move your vehicle in that carpark.

Thus, if you parked in the 2 hour zone for 1.5 hours and the unlimited zone for 1 hour then moved back into the 2 hour zone, you would be deemed to have parked in the 2 hour zone for 2.5 hours.

In order break the continuity you would need to drive out of the carpark and then back in again.

-------------
This post does not constitute legal advice and cannot be relied upon.


Posted By: crocodile
Date Posted: 08/March/2018 at 11:24
At last I have a hearing date on 5th April. Magistrate will allow the video. Just wondering if anybody knows how I obtain the brief of evidence from the prosecution. I tried the council but they fobbed me off.

Thanks

Not Guilty, I did actually move the car from the timed area to the untimed area. The amount of time in the 2 hour zone would have been about 30 minutes at the most.



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